These are just the few testimonials that I've received and been given permission to share. I've received hundreds of reports like these just from a few videos on the topic, and there's thousands of similar ones across the internet that show how being severely harmed by contemporary non-dual teachings based on permanent self-negation, in particular the most extreme forms that some refer to as neo-advaita and radical non-dualism, is not fringe, and how much this deserves our attention so that this trend can be addressed and transformed by discerning minds and compassionate hearts, and help encourage us as a society to choose and create new healthy, balanced spiritual narratives that heal, unify and uplift humanity.
*Be aware that for many people, adverse effects take time to arise and that many people can be both helped and harmed at the same time. As one psychotherapist described of clients who he helps recover "While initially finding their free-floating, infinitely empty, de-personalised perception as profound, they had eventually come to find it gnawingly devoid, numbly disconnected, and alienating."
*Be aware that for many people, adverse effects take time to arise and that many people can be both helped and harmed at the same time. As one psychotherapist described of clients who he helps recover "While initially finding their free-floating, infinitely empty, de-personalised perception as profound, they had eventually come to find it gnawingly devoid, numbly disconnected, and alienating."
TL;DR: Summary of the most commonly reported adverse effects of contemporary self-negating spirituality
De-personalization/de-realization, disassociation, dis-embodiment, nihilism, extreme alienation/isolation, unhealthy lost sense of agency, unwanted changes in social functioning and decreased capacity for personal relationships, damaged relationships with loved ones, difficulty fulfilling family and career roles, job loss, unwanted loss of motivation to engage in healthy previous passions, interests, hobbies, etc., shame, guilt, trouble maintaining healthy boundaries, split psyche/lasting fragmentation, meaninglessness, deep depression, hollowness, flatness, soul loss, deadness/zombification, feelings of madness, hospitalization, suicidal ideation, suicide, psychosis...
"These teachings kicked off my descent into the most horrifically lonely experience and I have been progressively climbing out of of it. This was the worst thing I have ever experienced, something beyond what I thought was possible." - Zoe
"The disconnection from myself, my family, my friends and my mind was so extreme. I was in a constant state of disorientation, and social isolation for a year." - Tegan
"Completely destroyed my vitality and isolated me beyond comprehension."
"I used to be so full of love, joy, happiness, connection, etc., until I stumbled across these newer non dual teachings. They have seemingly taken everything from me and ruined my life. I struggled for so long and I couldn't understand why I seemed to be the only one who had become nihilistic and completely mind fucked." - Morgan
"I was becoming convinced I had to die and when I couldn’t instigate that as metaphorical death, I was at times feeling like a total death would put an end to the merry go round of madness. A deal with the non dual devil was a great way to put it." - Tucker
"A good friend of mine described feeling like he wanted to end his life because he couldn't fulfill his role as a parent." -Marge
"I was zombied out and distanced from reality."
"After my experiences from non-dual inquiry I became reclusive, lost interest in everything. I could no longer relate to people in a conventionally spiritual sense, or a regular mundane sense. I also lost the motivation and intellectual capacity to continue in the profession in which I was trained." - G
"I could have these deep no self, no doer, pure awareness type experiences where I’d even let go of the one that wants to say “yes I’ve got it” but every time it was like “Robert” had to come back eventually to be able to relate to my family. I just couldn’t stay as the pure spacious awareness without somehow being detached from my families struggles or pain. It felt like there was this choice to stay with my family emotionally and physically or leave them permanently (like many of these “enlightened” folk seem to do). All the teachings said it was possible to stay physically but not keep being so affected by all the drama of family life. But for me this just seemed impossible. I just couldn’t have the empathy my family needed and keep the person "Russell” at arms length. It was like I could feel the moment “Russell” grabbed the reigns again. So again I’d practice, take it on the chin as another lesson and aspire to let go of him. And hopefully one day forever. It was like permanently being at war with a non existent person who just feels so real. It was exhausting.
It became the source of most of my suffering in the end. On top of the usual suffering of normal life. I couldn’t stop being me and also be a Dad, a husband, a son etc. I am both and, not either or. Wow what a subtle but profound shift. So so simple and nothing much changed but at the same time everything changed. It seems all in the interpretation." - Robert
It became the source of most of my suffering in the end. On top of the usual suffering of normal life. I couldn’t stop being me and also be a Dad, a husband, a son etc. I am both and, not either or. Wow what a subtle but profound shift. So so simple and nothing much changed but at the same time everything changed. It seems all in the interpretation." - Robert
"I was losing memories due to not having solid connection to my history!"
"Looking back, I can see the toxic nature of the teachings that were informing me. It has taken a life time to undo. Grateful for all the other survivors coming forward more recently. I was trying to be one with everything and to disappear into the cosmos before I had any positive ego strength." - Megan K.
"The numinous narcotic of Neo-Advaita nearly destroyed me."- Jessica R.
"Due to my sense of superiority and detachment (and confusion!) I have lost several valued friends, as well as my sense of meaning and purpose." - Sara
"This definition of enlightenment that I had learned cast shadow of “second-best” on my “non-enlightened” existence and was a constant subtle wedge between myself and my wife - who was actually very tolerant of my practice. Her passing a year ago brought into my awareness the stark reality of my foolishness and what I missed out on as a result.
"I lost my ability to trust myself, my own perspective, my own insight."
"I have been following a lot of these Neo Advaita teachings for a while. Mostly has just created more suffering and basically ruined my life. I have asked many teachers about this and they all have told me to just let the process happen. That my deep lack of motivation to do anything is really just the personal egoic motivation calming down and it will be replaced by something deeper if I keep going. I also have on and off depression out of nowhere and have been told by a lot of teachers that my depressive episodes are simply suppressed emotions coming up to be felt and I need to not resist them and just let them out. "The cure to the pain is the pain itself" I have no clue what is real at this point when it comes to these teachings. All of it is so confusing." - Anonymous
"Led to a total inability to handle every day life and relationships." - Nora
"This was my addiction. I marinated in the “no thingness” and I would experience the end of noise, activity, suffering, pleasure seeking, striving, problems etc. Then at some point in relationship to others something would seep back into the emptiness and off I would go “chasing the dragon”. More podcasts needed as the tolerance built up to the words that were becoming familiar so not giving the Same effect. More books, deeper meditations, etc." -Shana
"I've been going through intense nihilism. I'm just starting to come out of severe depression from it. - Sue
"I was in a constant state of disorientation, and social isolation for a year."
"For more than 7 months, I've been trying to recover from my harmful experience with "non-duality" or Neo-Advaita?? I was part of the satsang movement for 7 years, visited different teachers, watched thousands of videos, read hundreds of books etc. I was deeply looking for "enlightenment" and thought this could free me from my suffering.
I came home from a retreat one day and things started getting really weird. I got panic attacks daily but still thought I have to somehow "get it," really understand that there is no "self," and then all of this suffering will disappear. I spiraled down into a deep hole of obsessive thinking. At first I had just a few moments of depersonalization but it's been a constant condition for 7 months.
It's as if I'm living all their teaching, I feel like "I" disappeared and everything that's left of me is just this body, which isn't "mine" anymore, just a random bunch of flesh moving around doing things, but without a "doer" inside. I feel like a biological machine, programmed to talk, walk, eat and do stuff, but it all happens "without me".
So, if no-self is bliss, like they told me - I must feel very happy and liberated right now, but i don't. My life has been completely ruined for the last 7 months. I would do anything to get out of this condition, it feels so terribly wrong.
I'm not getting better and I think it's because I still somehow believe that their teachings are "the truth," and that I now realized it. I try to find arguments against these kind of teachings but nothing makes enough sense to really convince me.
I hope that someone can convince me that there is no ultimate truth out there and that we are not just biological robots running around." -Marina
I came home from a retreat one day and things started getting really weird. I got panic attacks daily but still thought I have to somehow "get it," really understand that there is no "self," and then all of this suffering will disappear. I spiraled down into a deep hole of obsessive thinking. At first I had just a few moments of depersonalization but it's been a constant condition for 7 months.
It's as if I'm living all their teaching, I feel like "I" disappeared and everything that's left of me is just this body, which isn't "mine" anymore, just a random bunch of flesh moving around doing things, but without a "doer" inside. I feel like a biological machine, programmed to talk, walk, eat and do stuff, but it all happens "without me".
So, if no-self is bliss, like they told me - I must feel very happy and liberated right now, but i don't. My life has been completely ruined for the last 7 months. I would do anything to get out of this condition, it feels so terribly wrong.
I'm not getting better and I think it's because I still somehow believe that their teachings are "the truth," and that I now realized it. I try to find arguments against these kind of teachings but nothing makes enough sense to really convince me.
I hope that someone can convince me that there is no ultimate truth out there and that we are not just biological robots running around." -Marina
"I've become a lost soul with no compass."
"The non-dual experience is just an experience. It is not an ultimate reality/truth. Moreover, non-dual philosophy was disempowering and led to apathy and dissociation, rather than lucid engagement with what appears to be so we can choose what meanings we will assign, consciously wielding our own wills like the incarnations of the godhead that we all are." -Kate
"After the "bliss phase", shit really hit the fan and it became a "living nightmare". Totally disconnected from life, love, lost any kind of interest about anything all. No motivation to do anything at all anymore. It was absolutely horrible.
But hey, no problem, it's not real, right? It's all in your mind. Just do nothing. I was really told this by famous teachers I know personally.
This kind of advice can literally kill you. Out of that I started to research and dig deep. What I found was mind-blowing and frightening in the same moment. I found more and more stories from people who weren't able to live or function anymore. Even killed themselves. "
But hey, no problem, it's not real, right? It's all in your mind. Just do nothing. I was really told this by famous teachers I know personally.
This kind of advice can literally kill you. Out of that I started to research and dig deep. What I found was mind-blowing and frightening in the same moment. I found more and more stories from people who weren't able to live or function anymore. Even killed themselves. "
"I was really into these "gurus" and would even listen to them every night before going to bed. I found their voices calming and enjoyed cutting myself off from the world and attaining ‘no thought’ states of being. Anyone trying to get you to not think is someone to be very cautious of. I went into a hermit like existence, not wanting to socialize with others. I was ‘zombied’ out and distanced from reality." -Francis
"It was disempowering and led to apathy and dissociation, rather than lucid engagement."
"I have been in a year-long recovery process from these dogmatic teachings and can say they completely destroyed my vitality and joy and isolated me beyond comprehension." -Candace
"Much of what I learned was “I am not a body” that my body was made to be an attack on God, that my ego made this body in an illusionary world. As I realized something wasn’t right I went through weeks of “unanswerable fear.” I found myself nervous and feeling like I was going a little crazy. ACIM was a huge reason for this, at first there was a warm fuzzy feeling that seemed to be inviting, but as I went through the practice with a well known group I started to realize everyone was wiped, there was no personality.
I feel fortunate to have had enough sense to ask, what is love? Because if this is love something is very wrong. There was so much rich teaching and experience in many of the non-duality circles, but most of it lead to the deadening of the mind and erasing of any personality. I looked for answers and everywhere I looked I was told “this is normal” you’re experiencing an “ego death.” After a while I couldn’t get behind it anymore, something in me said, leave.
The real spiritual journey I’m coming to accept is the “both and” unity and wholeness. I feel personality, relationships, interests, desires are all part of the whole. How can these things be “ego” how can living void of such things be “Reality?” I was suffering trying not to suffer. There are days I still experience sadness, but I feel like through stillness and videos like yours, my joy is coming back." -Anonymous
I feel fortunate to have had enough sense to ask, what is love? Because if this is love something is very wrong. There was so much rich teaching and experience in many of the non-duality circles, but most of it lead to the deadening of the mind and erasing of any personality. I looked for answers and everywhere I looked I was told “this is normal” you’re experiencing an “ego death.” After a while I couldn’t get behind it anymore, something in me said, leave.
The real spiritual journey I’m coming to accept is the “both and” unity and wholeness. I feel personality, relationships, interests, desires are all part of the whole. How can these things be “ego” how can living void of such things be “Reality?” I was suffering trying not to suffer. There are days I still experience sadness, but I feel like through stillness and videos like yours, my joy is coming back." -Anonymous
"Has my engagement with neo-Advaita and certain forms of Buddhism been harmful? Yes, in many ways. Primarily by not providing a foundation on which to build, leaving me in a constant state of euphoria, confusion, and fear. The experience is complex, nuanced, and disorienting. Your videos have given me encouragement to help me realign and refocus myself. Since discovering your work, I have stopped practicing structured meditation and have started to regain my sense of self, which I never intended to lose in the first place." - M.
"I can see the “cult-like” tendencies. I suppose the biggest issue that triggers me is the “spiritual gaslighting.” ACIM holds almost a dogmatic approach to “Spiritual awakening.” I no longer consider ACIM to be a spiritual text, rather a more of a psycho-philosophical text. It may have helpful ideas that points to non-duality, but it’s filled with very manipulative and destructive ideas. - B.M.
"Led to such a deep disconnect and split in my own psyche"
"For me, it feels like Neo-Advaita truly has become a bit of a plague in todays' spiritual world - there are people who kill themselves because they fall into this trap and I completely understand why. After reading Jed Mckenna for the first time, I became depressed for about a week. Life went from blooming and interesting to dull and meaningless - and everything it took was a trilogy by an "enlightened" being who uses a pseudonym for publication. It took a lot of personal experiences and a really deep dive into different non-dual traditions/epistemology to get out of this dark night of the soul." -Dillon
"I entered the world of Neo- Advaita teachings, satsangs and teachers, a world in which no one has inherent rights to decent treatment. There is no such thing as unique personal identity, other persons have no claim on us to behave honesty, conventional distinctions between truth/untruth, good/bad, right wrong just/unjust are meaningless, none of us has a claim to inherent personal dignity or basic human rights. This feels like "liberation" but for some of the bullying narcissistic "awakened" gurus, it seems like liberation to be a blissful psychopath."
"It's almost as if I was on heroin all the time."
"I was in a "non-duality" group that essentially was a cult for 6.5 years. When I left there were so many issues I had to face:
"the world not being 'real'" according to their teachings, losing memories due to not having solid connection to my history at that point, dealing with "bliss" junkie issues like being numb to everything around me in a supposed world that "didn't exist", and basically left to try to create my life from this disaster."
"the world not being 'real'" according to their teachings, losing memories due to not having solid connection to my history at that point, dealing with "bliss" junkie issues like being numb to everything around me in a supposed world that "didn't exist", and basically left to try to create my life from this disaster."
"One of the detriments of extreme non-duality on my psyche was the loss of my ability to trust myself, my own perspective, my own insights. The recovery has not been easy, but it’s happening." -Loren
"Neo Advaita became the same experience as the fundamentalist Christianity that I grew up with"
"My friend committed suicide after not being able to see his children and partner as anything more than constructs destroyed his family." -Marcus
"The "direct path" eventually led straight down into a psychological nightmare for myself and other community members." - Devorah
"I've become a lost soul with no compass." - Jay
"I had an amazing "spiritual experience" 5 years though it ended in panic and a feeling of depersonalization. Since then I thought I did something wrong because it ended and I need to do something to get back there. So I quickly came to the believe: My Ego is bad, it needs to be transcended. And that is what I thought for years till I got to Non-duality. Then everything became worse. Now I'm more disconnected, depressed, nihilistic than ever. Now I saw people on Youtube who describe their "Non-dual Realization" as permanent and they all say "there is no ME, there is no SELF, there is just this, there is no choice." I really see, how this makes me feel terrible and how dangerous this is, but there are always these thoughts: "My ego just doesn't want to hear this, having an Ego or a Self is false" and I just can not let go of it all because I always just see those "non-dual" people talking about that state and how that's the only real thing. So I'm in a loop of thinking that as long as I'm doing things out of ME and as long as I don't get that Realization, everything is wrong." - Yuri
"I know of individuals who have died and lost their minds - and the latter, well isn't that exactly what is being taught?" - Martin
"Hate your ego" and "kill your ego." This was pure poison.
"Once in this "blissed out state" it was extremely hard to get out of it. It's a very seductive place and the mind wants to be in it all the time. It's almost as if I was on heroin all the time. That's what a lot of these "teachers" are doing, it's like giving out heroin to everyone. When one is on heroin they stop caring about all the small dramas that make life what it is. I feel like now that I've tapped into this realm it is impossible to go back to how I was. Do people ever get over this seductive mind trap state? I was once an ambitious student going to one of the best schools in the country. Now I am in a constant stupor. "
"The guys I was listening to were sending out this critical, hateful perspective, and influenced this drive toward nothingness, being nothing and neglecting being fully human. "Hate your ego and "kill your ego" <-- This was pure poison."
"Neo Advaita became the same experience as the fundamentalist Christianity that I grew up with, causing such a deep disconnect and split in my own psyche which took many many many many years to unravel."
"The way I got out of a nihilistic non-dual trap was through my understanding of the word non-dual. It doesn't make sense to me to make the self/ego/nature an enemy... to say it is separate from "God". If there is no duality then all is "God". Separating ego and "God" is duality." - TJ
I felt so out-there for a while “spaced out." - A.
Therapists Speak
"A number of persons who had come to experience their “neo-advaitic enlightenment” as problematically disembodied contacted me for help. While initially finding their free-floating, infinitely empty, de-personalised perception as profound, they had eventually come to find it gnawingly devoid, numbly disconnected, and generally alienating.
They longed, instead, to come into their bodies, become personal and real, to feel and live, as concrete fleshly be-ings.
The experiences that these persons shared confirmed my observation: that the “radical transformation” induced by neo-advaita amounts to total disembodiment.
Certainly, there is something quite amazing about such an accomplishment, yet on the other hand, it is a form of craziness. And for me, and for those who contacted me, it was a source of severe suffering.
It was also extremely persistent. The maxims of neo-advita having become so built into the fabric of the persons’ minds: whenever someone started to come back into themselves, one or other precept (as a voice in their head) would kick in scupper the whole process.
Gradually, however, people began to get their embodiment back. Or rather: they began to be bodies for the first time in their lives: being rather than “having” a body; living rather than “having” a life." - Guy Smith
They longed, instead, to come into their bodies, become personal and real, to feel and live, as concrete fleshly be-ings.
The experiences that these persons shared confirmed my observation: that the “radical transformation” induced by neo-advaita amounts to total disembodiment.
Certainly, there is something quite amazing about such an accomplishment, yet on the other hand, it is a form of craziness. And for me, and for those who contacted me, it was a source of severe suffering.
It was also extremely persistent. The maxims of neo-advita having become so built into the fabric of the persons’ minds: whenever someone started to come back into themselves, one or other precept (as a voice in their head) would kick in scupper the whole process.
Gradually, however, people began to get their embodiment back. Or rather: they began to be bodies for the first time in their lives: being rather than “having” a body; living rather than “having” a life." - Guy Smith
"One of my friends and one of my clients, seemed to have slipped into a similar experience, with a total inability to handle every day life and relationships." - Nora